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Wednesday, November 28, 2007
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What Has Political Discourse Come To?

I started to leave a comment on Rick Esenberg's blog post on the subject, but then my comment started getting so long, that I thought it was best to make it into a post on it's own.  Here's the beginning of his post:

My Backstory friend Jim Rowen is concerned about political and social dialogue in our community. So am I. It's one of the reasons that I continue this blog which, to date, has resulted in neither fame nor fortune. Jim was concerned that Charlie Sykes characterized one of his posts about the blogosphere's Coexistential crisis as "hating" conservatives. He wrote:

And let me point out that I get along fine with any number of conservatives, including my "Backstory" (WMCS-AM 1130) roundtable colleague Rick Esenberg, the conservative blogger and Marquette Law School teacher.

Have we disagreed about many things? Of course. That's part of the reason Eric Von had us as regulars (I have fallen away: Rick is more reliable). But do I hate Rick?

Of course not. And I'd be shocked if he said he thought I do.

I see a lot to be concerned with among many of the political commentators, even Sykes, Wagner, and Harris which Rick seems to think aren't that bad.  I especially see it among commentators like O'Reilly in the national media.  I also see it among many of the commentators on the left, and even among many of the columnists and bloggers who gain great attention for themselves.

What so many tend to do is lump together groups of people in large groups, and then condemn them together with simple labels and little explanation.  You see it when they talk about "the left", and how "they" hate America, as if hundreds of thousands or even millions of people can be easily lumped together in that way, and somehow "hating America" is some simple notion.  You see it in how "neocons" are talked about by some, and how the definition of that word has become so broad as to be nearly meaningless.

All sorts of new words and phrases are being thrown about so that some commentators don't have to go to the trouble of making arguments any more.  They can simply throw out a label like "secular progressive" and suddenly everyone nods.  Of course, the problem with "the culture" (as if it's singular") are those damned "SP's".  They're the ones responsible for my lot in life!  Any time you can take a label and make an acronym out of it is really a bonus, and Bill O'Reilly should be commended for his creativity.

I worry about all of this because in the zeal to simplify all these arguments, we're narrowing down the spectrum of views into things that can only fit into big boxes.  You're either on the left, or you're on the right.  Left means you believe in a, b, and c while right must mean want x, y and z.  Never mind that most people have a much wider alphabet of beliefs, and that some on the "left" might actually believe in x, and vice versa.  That complicates things too much.  Acknowledging such a spectrum in opinion would require that people actually make arguments against ideas instead of people, and Lord knows we can't have that.

In general, I try (not always successfully) to debate ideas.  And for my part, I generally stop listening to people when they start saying "the left" or "the right" too much.  If the basis of your argument comes down to those sides, then I don't want to be on yours.

# Posted at 9:06 AM by Nick  |  Comment Feed Link 4 Comments  |  No Trackbacks

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Wednesday, November 28, 2007 2:17:47 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
I cringe every time I type the words "the Left," but it's usually better than the alternative of typing something like, "those who oppose/favor the opposite side of whatever point I'm making." ;)
Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:44:03 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
Nick,
I feel you. I try to avoid it but often fall into it. I have many friends who are "lefties" who have caed called me on it. I will try harder in the future.
James T.
Wednesday, November 28, 2007 8:28:34 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
For many blogs out there, simply criticizing the current Administration gets you branded a lefty. No calls for taxation or nanny-state antics necessary; you're tarred a lefty and dismissed. Or booted, as the case may be. No form of judgment exists other than a teeter-totter of two-dimensional politics. Say something that's not within three inches of Our Side and you've upset the balance and are tossed to the other end.

I started writing a reply to Esenberg's latest, too, but like you, gave up when it got too long. It was as if I was fisking every other pair of words, pointing out his loaded words, his gross generalizations, his lack of sophisticated reasoning. His attempt at a summary was indeed weak "dimestore Sykes-ology," as I wanted to say. I expected much more, given the mental requirements of his professional position and the intelligence I often see in his writing. He'd previously given me the impression he was better than that.

You mention "the culture" while Esenberg used "mainstream". I wrote "'mainstream' means Us when it's something we want, but it's Them when it's promoting values We don't like."

And in today's post, did Esenberg purposefully or accidentally type "Mostly what I hear on TMJ is fairly meanstream conservatism"? :-)

Yes, 'Coexist' is cheerfully idealistic. But there's also something very traditionally United States of America about it, when you come down to it. It was just as gleepy in 1945 for some very popular movies to point out that a ragtag bunch of young men from Brooklyn and Iowa and Texas, descended from Poles, Irish and Italians, Christian and Jew, could get along together and even want to die for each other when fighting those Nazis.
Thursday, November 29, 2007 3:28:05 PM (Central Standard Time, UTC-06:00)
The simple fact is that Sykes, Wagner, Weber, McIlheran and so on are mainstream conservatives.

Jim Rowen fusses and fumes and talks about how evil they are, and clearly would like to shut them up -- although probably by having their employers fire them rather than by government action. (Although my guess is that he favors the Fairness Doctrine.)

You can try to parse the issue in more detail and nuance, but the reality is a huge amount of liberal/left intolerance toward conservatives.

Calling conservatives "angry" of "divisive" when they disagree with liberals is itself "divisive."

This really isn't symmetrical. There is more anger and venom and hate in the liberal/left blogosphere. Yea, I know you can point to very unkind things said on the right, but the numbers are pretty one-sided.
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